Fares row erupts as East Lothian Buses launched

Bryan Copland • Published 31 May 2012 09:28 38 Comments

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EAST Lothian's parliamentarians have accused former East Lothian Council leader Paul McLennan of the "worst type of political opportunism" over claims he misled Pencaitland and Ormiston residents on fares for a new bus.

The No 113 - run by East Lothian Buses, a new subsidiary company of Lothian Buses - starts on June 11, taking over from the X13 service which First is withdrawing. It will connect Pencaitland and Ormiston with Musselburgh and Edinburgh.

Labour's Iain Gray MSP and Fiona O'Donnell MP claim that Mr McLennan (SNP) had "categorically promised" at a meeting of village residents in May that the new service would have a flat fare of £1.40 - as is the case across the whole Lothian Buses network. However, passengers will pay a flat rate of £2.40 when travelling to and from Pencaitland and Ormiston on the 113.

Mr McLennan (pictured) hit back by saying there had been "no indication" in May that the service would cost more and accused Labour of "mistruths" regarding buses in East Lothian.

Mr Gray said: "Two days before the election Councillor McLennan stood in front of hundreds of residents of Pencaitland and Ormiston and categorically promised them a new Lothian bus service with a flat fare of £1.40. I am disappointed that my constituents will have to pay a higher fare than Lothian passengers in the city, but I am furious that the then council leader was prepared to blatantly mislead them in this way.

"These sorts of antics give politicians a bad name and he should apologise to the people of Ormiston and Pencaitland for misleading them."

Ms O'Donnell added: "I was at the meeting and heard Mr McLennan promise a £1.40 fare with my own ears. This is the worst kind of political opportunism."

But Mr McLennan said in a statement: "Lothian Buses had only indicated that same afternoon that they would be running the service commercially. There was no indication at that stage that they would be costing the service at £2.40.

"Perhaps what Iain Gray and Fiona O'Donnell should be comparing costs with is the First fare price which was £3.60 - [the new fare is] a saving of 33 per cent on the previous fare with First for passengers.

"They should explain how during the [recent local election] campaign they quoted mistruths regarding East Lothian Council bus subsidies being cut by £200,000 when they had increased by more than £250k (25 per cent).

"In addition, passengers should be aware that Iain Gray's pledge to re-regulate bus services would cost the council £20 million.

"The Labour Party also pledged to provide a bus service to every village in what they admitted was an uncosted manifesto they cannot provide."

Ian Craig, managing director of Lothian Buses, said: "June 11 welcomes the start of East Lothian's newest bus service, operated by East Lothian Buses. Service 113 will run from Pencaitland and Ormiston to Edinburgh city centre and the Western General Hospital seven days a week running every hour with additional buses at peak times.

"There will be a simple fare structure that offers significantly lower fares than the current First bus ticket price.

"A single ticket will now cost £2.40, and a DAYticket will now cost £5 as opposed to £7.30. In addition, East Lothian Buses will offer a brand new RIDACARD season ticket that offers passengers unlimited travel on East Lothian Buses, all Lothian Buses and AIRLINK."

Ralph Averbuch, chair of Pencaitland Community Council, said he was "relieved" but called for the council to "address what they are going to do about connecting up the various villages and communities around East Lothian".

First is carrying out a staggered withdrawal of 13 East Lothian services throughout June. All cancelled routes are being taken on by other bus companies and, while most will start immediately after First's withdrawal, some will be without services during a one to two-week handover period.

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Robert McNeill
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May 31, 11:24
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In this case I have no sympathy with Cllr Paul McLennan he stood up a packed meeting in Pencaitland and made an announcement, flat fare structure and no disruption to the current service.

Paul please for the second time in a matter of days apologise to the good people of the village for totally misleading them.

Recommend? Yes 17 No 9
Inspecor Blakey
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May 31, 13:13
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Yip Paul....you stated did state and the Courier quoted you....that Lothian would run the service on a commercial basis using the same flat fare system

Courier - the 113 service is a replacement for the 44c to Edinburgh City Centre, there is no replacement for the x13.

On paper the service is poorer for Pencaitland/Ormiston residents - no X13 and the last bus at night runs earlier than FIRST.

Who wants to sit on a bus stuck trundling through musselburgh stuck in congestion, which will get worse when the new houses are built at Pinkie Road

Recommend? Yes 9 No 1
paul tallman
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May 31, 14:36
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Robert McNeill is right. We need a serious apology from all who are peddling lies about the bus services in East Lothian.

Labours election pledge to provide a bus service to every village if they are voted back in will have attracted a lot of voters. Residents of East Lothian put their faith in Labour and this pledge and voted them back in. What a slap in the face then for those people when what they actually got was "withdrawal of 13 East Lothian services".

How Labour can claim that East Lothian Council bus subsidies are being cut by £200,000 when it had actually increased by more than £250'000? This was obviously nothing more than a blatant lie to try and cover up their bogus election pledge.

Is this U-turn due to the alliance Labour made with the Tories? Which one of these parties is actually making the decisions for the residents of East Lothian? These questions need an open, honest explanation. Iain Gray and Fiona O'Donnel should be demanding a transparent investigation into the deceptive, underhand tactics of the Labour party instead of diverting attention to the SNP.

Recommend? Yes 10 No 6
Robert McNeill
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May 31, 15:02
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Paul Tallman

Nonsense ,the problem lies firmly with the SNP , are you now saying that everyone who attended that meeting were wrong in what they heard from Paul McLennan.

Labour have only been in power for under a month, the SNP had five years to sort this problem out.

The problem is not just a local issue but a national issue which the Scottish Government have failed to address

The problem with the NATS is that they have been found out within weeks of defeat how inept they really are, GOD FORBID THEM RUNNING AN INDEPENDENT SCOTLAND

Recommend? Yes 12 No 7
paul tallman
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May 31, 15:10
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Robert McNeil,

The issue is not the length of time that Labour have been in power. Its the fact they lied to the residents of East Lothian. They promised if they were voted back in they would "provide a bus service to every village".

Now they are doing as you are, and blaming the SNP when they cannot deliver the goods. They should apologise to the people who put their trust in them. They made a pledge they knew they had no intention of seeing through.

I hope this will not be a recurring theme, where forever more we get an incompetent Labour/Tory council blaming all their failings on the previous administration.

Recommend? Yes 12 No 5
paul tallman
Unregistered User
May 31, 15:16
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Robert McNeill,

You must understand that in an independent Scotland you will be free to vote for whoever you want to run the country.

And the people of Scotland seem to have a lot of faith in the SNP running Scotland since they were returned to power with a huge majority over Labour and all other parties.

So it could be very well be Labour running an independent Scotland in the future. Would that ease your mind? (I assume you are another die hard Labour voter).

Recommend? Yes 7 No 4
Robert McNeill
Unregistered User
May 31, 15:25
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Paul Tallman

I have taken the advice of Colin Yorkston and decided no longer will I use my assumed name " Socialist" as I you probably guessed anyway.

Who said they cannot deliver the goods, where in this article is that being suggested, surely you cannot believe a word Paul McLennan says.

Recommend? Yes 5 No 2
paul tallman
Unregistered User
May 31, 15:37
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I didnt mind your old name. Why do you feel you had to change to your real name?

Recommend? Yes 0 No 3
Robert McNeill
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Jun 1, 08:31
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paul tallman

its like I have lifted a great burden from my shoulders,

Recommend? Yes 4 No 0
paul tallman
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 08:56
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I suppose it was dragging you down, it was too much a reflection of traditional Labour values, values they long ago abandoned. So at least now you are free to promote the party in their current form; newer Labour, newest new Labour, Lab/Tory, Lavatory Alliance (I forget what they call themselves now).

Remember though, name change or not, you still owe me a pint when Scotland votes 'YES'.

(I never forget when someone owes me a drink).

Recommend? Yes 2 No 2
Robert McNeill
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 09:09
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cheers

Recommend? Yes 3 No 0
Inspector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 10:47
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yip here is the article

Mr McLennan told members of the public at the meeting that Lothian Buses would take over running commercial services to the villages of Ormiston and Pencaitland when First withdrew.

It was also indicated Lothian would operate the service at the same flat rate which covers all its other services, a lower fare than that currently offered by First Bus.

mmmm No flat fare and part of the service is being paid for by ELC

Recommend? Yes 3 No 0
Inspector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 10:53
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since the first deregulated services started in May 86, many have benefited and many have lost out.

£1 use to take you from Seton Sands to the west end in 86, now 26 years later £1.40 takes you to clerwood.

When Ian Glass started up, the fare from haddington to edinburgh was a £1, what is it now?

Politicians are all the same, I've been to Public meetings, were Councillors have told us one thing, only to find out after the meeting that they had been misleading us and lying to the people at the meeting.......and they flew the Red Flag (which is now a red shade of blue)

Interesting times ahead On the Buses in East Lothian........North Berwick route is next, who wants to sit on a x24, trundling through musselburgh......

Recommend? Yes 2 No 0
mike52
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 11:19
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Paul Tallman

while i was more then happy to come to the defense of Paul when he was being made the fall guy by Currie i really have to bring him to task on his blethering and selective memory when it comes to what he said during the council election's on the Pencaitland Service now trying to put a spin on the fact's speak for them self's the ending of the Bus operator's Grant has not helped in any way Robert is correct the SNP have been exposed as a bunch of spiv's who were happy to say anything to get them re elected the recent non payment to Ross Hardie which while resolved still show's that they are not in a position to lecture any one when it comes to running a council East Lothian as i have said before is well rid. By the way have you filled in your application for the post of SNP Press officer yet ?

Recommend? Yes 4 No 0
Inpector Blakey
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Jun 1, 11:28
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maybe the Councillors would be better getting Lothian Buses to publish a proper link on their website about the 113 service.....there is a link but nothing under news.

EL Council website....nothing......You'd think that our council would have page..... advising us of the new companies and routes......mind you that would be common sense.....

Recommend? Yes 3 No 0
paul tallman
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 12:53
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Mike52,

There is no evidence from the article that Paul McLennan has denied saying the fare would be £1.40, so he does not have 'selective memory' as you claim.

As the article points out when he made that statement there was "no indication" that running the new service would cost more.

The Bus Operator's Grant was reduced as a direct result of Tory cuts to the Scottish Government's Block Grant. Scotland simply does not get enough money from Westminster to be able to subsidise rural bus routes now.

This is Labours mess to sort out. They made promises to the residents of East Lothian that if elected they would save the buses. Now they are trying to distract everyone by puffing up stories about the SNP. This is nothing more than a diversion.

That is where you are seeing the lies and selective memory. What are Labour doing RIGHT NOW to sort this mess?

Recommend? Yes 5 No 4
Robert McNeill
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 13:08
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paul tallam

Nonsense Paul you are trying to be a wee troublemaker, admit it ,Paul was a very bad boy for making these statements at a packed public meeting, why does he not just say sorry for telling fibs

Recommend? Yes 7 No 2
paul tallman
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 13:30
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Robert 'the Socialist' McNeill

Not at all. I am simply trying to add some balance and common sense to the comments.

Perhaps he will if Iain Gray and Fiona O'Donnell apologise first. I would have thought that as Labour MSP and MP for East Lothian (one even a former Labour party leader)they should be looking to set an example of decency.

Personally I'd rather Labour focused on sorting out this mess, rather than wasting our spinning stories. The longer Labour do this, the longer the people of East Lothian lose out.

Recommend? Yes 2 No 6
Robert McNeill
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Jun 1, 13:39
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paul tallman

I am confident this matter will be sorted out, but it is important that they whole community is involved with coming up with solutions, come on Paul we all like to make political points thats what we do just like you and I on this site.

Recommend? Yes 3 No 0
mike52
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 15:41
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Paul

Nothing that you have said on this matter makes any sense the truth is that Paul tried to pull the wool over everyone' s eye's and was found out telling fib's pure and simple

Recommend? Yes 6 No 0
paul tallman
Unregistered User
Jun 1, 16:14
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mike52,

The article in this paper does not suggest that Paul McLennan told any lies. Anyone reading it can see that.

Labour seem to have this monotonous habit of continually throwing mud at the SNP, hoping something might eventually stick. I think people would rather they just got on with running the council rather than trying to score cheap political points.

Recommend? Yes 2 No 6
Local
Unregistered User
Jun 2, 09:56
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Paul

over the they've done it to almost every opposition party Councillor

dragged up muck and slagged them off

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plob
Unregistered User
Jun 2, 10:45
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I attended the recent Association of Community Councilsl meeting on bus routes,

It was clear that the suggested £1-40 single was mentioned at Ormiston and Pencaitland community meeting. However, it was also clear that this was before the end of discussions with the new route provider. There had been no firm agreement on price and so Councilor McLennan should not have referred to this.

The new rate is greater than £1-40 flat rate Lothian fare

It is important that Clr McLennan explains this

Recommend? Yes 10 No 0
Lushlolly
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Jun 3, 10:00
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Can someone please tell me what Fiona O'Donnell and Iain Gray have done for the people of East Lothian. The bus mess in Pencaitland/Ormiston should lie a Labour's door - after all they are the party who got this once great country into trouble. The Scottish Government have cut the bus grant - First Bus got too greedy - and where were our "great" defenders of cuts in services. Are labour prepared to accept most of the blame - I think not.

Recommend? Yes 3 No 7
ralphaverbuch
35 posts
Jun 3, 15:04
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@Inspector Blakely

"EL Council website....nothing......You'd think that our council would have page..... advising us of the new companies and routes......mind you that would be common sense..... "

I would tend to agree that the ELC website really ought to be up at the forefront of providing updates on all matters affecting East Lothian... most especially so for people concerned over public transport.

We've had two stories on the new bus routes up on our own little website on the 25th...

http://edubuzz.org/pccouncil/east-lothian-bus-update-the-113-44-routes/

...and 30th...

http://edubuzz.org/pccouncil/113-bus-timetable-published-but-some-commuters-unhappy/

Ralph

Pencaitland

Recommend? Yes 1 No 0
Inpector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 3, 21:36
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ralphaverbuch

thanks for the link

hopefully they will not be using midi buses (52 plated).

no surprise that ELC website hasn't any info, but given that number of changes and the variety of operators that will be taking over the routes, you think they might have had a summary page...but that would take common sense and planning.

It does sound like Lothian will be using a set of regular drivers on the new route.

One thing....passengers wont need scarves and hats during the winter...things normally work on Lothian buses - there buses have all been bought this century - unlike FIRST who haven't bought a new bus for east lothian since last century........anything else is pass me downs (cascaded is FIRST latest term for 2nd hand buses)

Lothian have been a bit slow for once, given the other changes that they are making on east lothian routes next week......hopefully they aren't taking their eye off things like FIRST did.......

Recommend? Yes 2 No 0
Karlt68
Unregistered User
Jun 4, 11:33
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Well I'm just pleased that there's a bus. £2.40 is steep but better than before on First. And as has been said, the quality of the buses is going to be better. Shame there's no scope for a return ticket instead of a day pass at £5. Shame also they can't run an express during peak times as trundling through Musselburgh and into Wallyford is a killer. If the price goes up I'll be disappointed and get a car/moped.

Recommend? Yes 3 No 0
Karlt68
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Jun 4, 11:36
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As regards the politics of the whole thing.... a disgrace. No wonder no one gives two hoots about the political process. All as bad as each other, scoring points and lying.

Recommend? Yes 0 No 1
Inspector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 4, 13:50
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ralph

midlothian are no better,was looking for info on the 110, found a page on bus services, but it refers to contracts to 2016 with FIRST, on routes that are being withdrawn.

Lothian still no mention of the whitecraig service......

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Lushlolly
Unregistered User
Jun 4, 16:10
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I was under the impression that Lothian was going to extend the 44 into whitecraig on their wallyford route ....

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Inspector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 4, 18:51
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lushlolly.....but try and find out about anything other than the 113 service, the info on the replacement services is very hard to find....both East and Midlothian have nothing

bizarelly FIRST were actually FIRST with information on their website about their haddington and North Berwick services

funny couple of old dears in north berwick were worrying how they would get to Musselburgh now that its only the x24 service (which will run through musselburgh) ....again the assumption that everyone has a web access..

East Lothian may have sorted out the services...but have failed with giving info to the public

Recommend? Yes 0 No 0
ralphaverbuch
35 posts
Jun 5, 18:00
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To be fair to Lothian Buses (as East Lothian Buses) has put up a bunch of A3 laminated posters on local bus stops on the 113 route informing people of the stops and costs. They've been up about a week. Someone thought it'd be funny to turn one nearest me upside down of course...

Ralph

Pencaitland

http://pencaitland.org | @pencaitlandcc | http://facebook.com/pencaitland

Recommend? Yes 0 No 0
Inpector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 5, 21:20
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I was referring to East Lothian Council,

yip Lothian are normally fairly on the ball when it comes to giving out info.

Even there timetables have a detailed route map........

compare that to FIRSTs timetables for the x services, anyone new would think that the bus only stops at the stops listed in the timetable....

however on their website (as at now) there is a link under 'Service Updates' for East & Mid Lothian........only trouble is .......it tells you nothing.

Recommend? Yes 0 No 0
Unhappy Mother
Unregistered User
Jun 7, 01:06
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There is no option for a weekly advanced pass from Ormiston to Edinburgh, At present im paying 24.50 a week my daughters student pass from First Buses, now I discover that she can't use a Lothian Buss Rida Card for zones C (Ormiston ect) for a Advances weekly purchase of a Student pass costing 21.00, so now this is going to cost me 5.00 per day for a her to attend colledge and also for the weekend to catch up with her friends, so instead of 24.50 on First Buses or now the cheaper Rida Crad for students of 21.00 week im now going to have to pay 35.00 per week, al because she is in zone C this is a totall disgrace and was never brough to attention, soon i will be paying for 2 kids to attend colledge and this will be costing me 70.00 a week for both to attend.............Very Unhappy Mother :(

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Ormistonvillager
Unregistered User
Jun 7, 11:17
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been trying to get a ridacard, but LRT tell me that they won;t have them available until next week, which is no good to man nor beast, as I need one starting from Monday moring, so in the mean time I am going to have to shell out £5 per day on a day ticket. Also I don't know why they haven't got Express services running in the morning/evening, its going to be a nightmare travelling to and from work each day now.

Recommend? Yes 0 No 0
Inspector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 7, 20:52
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Unhappy Mother

think you should be contacting Lothian Buses as there EL subsidiary is clearly advertising cheap student tickets

http://www.eastlothianbuses.com/

from what I can see the application forms are not available until 11 June....

weekly tickets are listed as

adult : £25

student : £21

child : £15

not sure were you are getting the £35 from

it clearly states that the ELB ridacard can be used on ELB, LB and the airport service

Recommend? Yes 0 No 0
Inspector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 7, 20:57
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Ormistonvillager

it is bizarre that Lothian haven't got their tickets in place

but still £5 x 5 = £25, which is still cheaper than a weekly ticket from FIRST, yes more expensive if you are using it more than 5 day, but you get to use a lot more services for your money....yip more for less and on buses that were built this century..!!!!

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Inspector Blakey
Unregistered User
Jun 7, 21:00
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Ormistonvillager

no limited stop service, FIRST are cutting routes as they have been losing money.

Limited stop services tend to be more expensive to run as buses are only used at the start and finish of the day so are sitting about not making money during the day.

Recommend? Yes 0 No 0

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